Which is rarely going to be true for even cursory balance levels.Įnemies 'quick attacking' wouldn't do anything to dash spam either, because you'd just dash through them like you do now and still take no damage. ![]() That is, "being able to beat the game with an option/without an option" doesn't say much about the relative balance of something, unless it's SO weak you cannot win at any skill level after taking it. If I had a run with all legendary upgrades it would be much easier and quicker than one without. ![]() That does not, then, imply common upgrades are just as strong as legendary. That doesn't necessarily follow - I could beat the game without ever selecting anything more than 'common' level upgrades and deliberately ignoring rare/epic/legendary. Originally posted by mokkun.tauren:You can beat the game without using Dash, which means Dash invuln isn't the problem. You can beat the game without using Dash, which means Dash invuln isn't the problem. Right now you can shoulder your way through enemies. I think a lot of enemies need a very quick attack they do if they're not winding something else up that they use when you're in super close proximity. It's the fact that there's no damage taken from being in contact with enemies. And since dash invulnerability is better than any other defense, armor, hp, and block chance are pretty irrelevant too (but do you really want players relying primarily on passively tanking hits anyway?).The thing that makes it so easy to be invulnerable isn't the dash invulnerability. Move speed and the penalty from Leviathan are also mostly irrelevant, because you move via dash-spamming. If you add more so that you can reliably catch the player between dashes, then you just set up 'unavoidable damage' which isn't great. Originally posted by Corseth:There's already enough enemy AOE's on the ground, and they're already pretty hard to track with all the visual effects going on at once. I'm not sure how players would receive that change though, usually folks hate feeling 'nerfed', but I have no idea how to fairly balance the sheer amount of invulnerability players currently get via making monsters alone stronger but somehow not 'cheap'. If I had to actually care where I positioned (because I can't just spam dash to get out of anything), I might care about move speed more and the chance to tank a hit or two if I get caught, and THEN enemy damage becomes easier to tweak to change difficulty. IMO? Get rid of the dash on the skill tree and make the bonus dash drop Legendary (so having two or more dashes is hard to get), or tweak the cooldown system for dashing again. And since dash invulnerability is better than any other defense, armor, hp, and block chance are pretty irrelevant too (but do you really want players relying primarily on passively tanking hits anyway?). In other words, if you just make the enemies outrageously lethal and spammy to counter that the player is invulnerable so very often, you're likely to just make them feel 'cheap'. You could make things hit harder (right now, even a zero defense, zero bonus hp build can tank quite a few hits), but since dashing means getting hit at all is a rarity, you'd have to push things to one-shot territory, which isn't great. There's already enough enemy AOE's on the ground, and they're already pretty hard to track with all the visual effects going on at once. This is tricky to make "harder" via tuning the enemy or the environment, whether you have some sort of affix system or not. Most regular enemy attacks already struggle to hit a player who is just moving in a straight line, even slowly, while dash's iframes mean you don't really even need to avoid the telegraphs on the ground because you'll usually be invulnerable when they hit. With 2 dashes alone, getting hit at all becomes a rarity. You can far too easily be invulnerable almost all the time that matters with just 2 dashes, let alone 3. My observation, like the OP, is that the dash mechanic is going to make it very hard to balance this game.
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